A couple of questions regarding the fischer of men . . . . . . . .

I am about ready to give up on Fisch even replacing the talent lost thru the portal (forget about graduation). Thankfully, the losses will stop in a couple of days but by then I fear finding an overlooked gem or eight will be nearly impossible.

And, yes, Jedd is probably looking to add only 4-5 more. Tops. Still think we need MINIMUM 2 DL, 1 edge, one starting WR and maybe one proven depth piece on the OL.

I feel like I am poking a dead body with a stick. C'mon man, do something.
Jedd's counting on the balance of the replacements and upgrades coming in with young talent either coming in and playing as freshmen or those on the roster (that stayed) taking leaps forward

Given that the best programs are stockpiling both talent and age ... you're already looking at some built in limitations to the roster regardless
 
I was thinking more to the future with UW and Minnesota. Don't have high hopes here. I don't think UW and Minnesota are at all comparable in the recent past. There also isn't a good other program to compare UW to. Maybe Michigan but they aren't nearly at the historical level of that program and Michigan appears to care and have funding.

DeBoer didn't have to rebuild. He inherited a team that took an all-time bad coach who took a team that should have been 8-4 at worst and somehow went 4-8. His offense had two rookie starting NFL OTs, 5 NFL WRs, 2 NFL TEs and some decent talent on defense that were on their third years at least of college.

Rebuilding now simply seems like if you're willing to spend psychotic amounts of money. Which sucks and who cares.
For UW (or anybody in this era) to be good going forward you need the following:

1. You need upper campus to be invested in the marketing/branding that athletics can have for the University as a whole and have alignment on how upper campus can leverage athletics

2. You need an Athletic Director that is business centric that treats football as part of a Billion dollar business that is hyper competitive about locking in funding, on-field performance, and telling the story needed to link branding, awareness, etc. of the program as well as its role as part of the University ecosystem as a whole

3. You must have a head coach and football operations staff that not only can identify talent but also connect with the players to ensure strong recruitment of those players with their fit into the program (and individual futures) as well as ensuring proper retention of player talent on the roster (keep those that are part of the solution and cutting ties with those that aren't)

4. You need to secure the funding from large whale investor(s) that are aligned to the overall vision with all parties presenting a compelling business case for the investor to sign off on and view themselves not only as a business partner but key stakeholder in the program's overall success.

It's not hard to see why this is all a HUGE issue for the University of Washington:

1. UW isn't a University that is necessarily worried about athletic success impacting their overall branding and profile. It's a Top public university and that's going to remain true whether football shits on itself or is wildly successful. It's not a place that is trying to expand its overall student population so it doesn't necessarily need the lift in applications that often comes with athletic success ... at best the jump in applications during high water points of athletic success may nominally increase the underlying average applicant ... at worst it's just noise in applications that equates to additional time, energy, and likely cost to sift through those applications by undergraduate admissions. And lastly, because of the University's profile academically there's little to no worry about a decline in the quality of the accepted applicant pool due to athletics. So you're stuck in a really awkward spot where unless athletics is a focal point of a University President or whatnot, athletics is not going to be viewed as a priority for upper campus as long as its operating at an acceptable level ... notably as long as athletics isn't an embarrassing representation of the University.

2. Chun is here because he had to find a lifeboat to rescue him from Wazzu. You don't have to look hard to find instances where people have interacted with Chun and not walked away as impressed. In no way does he look like he's bought into the University of Washington nor does he come off as a hyper competitive person who has a desire to win in everything they do. Instead, he looks like the same type of bureaucratic administrator that has paraded around college athletics for too long and is frankly outdated. There's probably still a role for him in college athletic administration but it's not at a place like UW where the competition level with its peers is completely in a kill or be killed environment.

3. Fisch is a mixed bag here ... his talent evaluations and roster management have been bright spots to his tenure whereas his on-field coaching has some flags and the fact that he's struggled to satisfactory commit to the program has lasting impacts throughout his roster and with fans/donors. It's no secret that there isn't strong alignment between his boss (Chun) and that leads to some significant issues. The last 2 weeks has provided some insight into him perhaps not having the pulse on his team/players like maybe he thought he did.

4. This is really the most important aspect and the issues you have with Chun and Fisch making it next to impossible to go to well funded "investors" with a buttoned up business case for investment that a donor is going to sign off on ... never forget that donors aren't uber wealthy by accident. Then you add one of the biggest issues that people in this region have (compared to other areas of the country) in that in the older donor population you have a sensibility and modesty to them that doesn't just blindly throw around "fuck you money" around as a passion project ... instead they invest with purpose and need to feel good about the return on their investment. How you define that return can be different for each donor but it's becoming increasingly difficult to produce that in the current environment.

So it's overall messy and hard to see where this gets better before it probably gets a bit worse without some systemic change (which goes to why the UW President attached his name to what he did this week) ...

It's one of the big reasons why I've been so adamant about things being precarious for UW (notably if Jedd was to leave) because the infrastructure under the hood right now is so unaligned that whenever the band-aid gets ripped off it could get really ugly.

If we're prioritizing ... Chun needs to be ousted before Jedd leaves
 
Right now to me you're looking at a very small group of teams that can actually compete on the highest level.

Group 1 - Programs that were really stable when college football took a monstrous shit AND will psychotically burn money - Ohio State, Oregon, Georgia, Notre Dame and Texas are kind of in there. Michigan can be here if they turn it back around.

Group 2 - Programs that spend too much money to fail and can work the portal some of which are aided by being - A&M, Texas Tech, Miami. USC tries but still can't. LSU and Tennessee too.

Group 3 - Program that hired a guy who is on the Saban/Harbaugh/Urban level who turned themselves into Group 1 overnight - Indiana

The problem is right now if you're not in one of these groups it's really hard to care because you feel locked out of competing for anything that matters especially with bowl games not mattering and this isn't a pro league where you get better draft picks if you fail. It's actually the opposite.
10 years ago success in college football was largely dictated on some combination of 1) geography, 2) history, and 3) ability to look the other way and spend money under the table

Today, the free flowing of funds has largely reduced the impact of geography and stabilized "approved" spending ... so now success is completely aligned based on 1) the size of your LEGAL variable spend through NIL, 2) how much you're willing to laugh at whatever regulatory agency is in charge of "illegal spend" and 3) the ability to secure a billionaire level investor(s) that is willing to fund a program as some kind of passion project, etc. and isn't necessarily concerned about there being a monetary ROI in their investment

In the end you're still going to get roughly the same number of teams in any given year that can win a Natty but the distribution of who gets to sit at that table can and will change versus what it was 10 years ago.
 
I have to disagree on Petersen. In Portland his first 2 years only reinforced the narrative that Boise coaches do nothing after Boise. I don't know what media saw it coming, this site certainly didn't. I called in to Chest and Roadies show and we were worried about fucking ASU at that point, let alone Stanford/Oregon.

Year 3 with no portal. Okay, but there's also no portal. Gaines can't leave, etc. it works both ways.
You had to be an idiot to not see the 2016 UW season coming

The litmus test for that team was the early PAC game at Arizona given the disasters that we always had down there and its timing as a massive trap game ...

As soon as we found a way to win that game it was always going to be a downhill ride towards playing to win the PAC12 and a potential CFP berth
 
Pales in comparison to Jedd obviously

Not everyone takes over the greatest 4-8 team in history

Nothing stopped Jedd from "only" bringing in great players and coaching them up or taking what was there and coaching that up

Except Jedd


That's the point on DeBoer or Cig
Yes they are rare because most coaches suck. Keep looking
 
When talking of Kalen DeBoer my Alabama guy at work sounds kinda like me talking about Judd for year 3.
Me: If Fish goes 8-4 again he's got to go. I need 10-2 and playoffs, full stop. A three year build to 8-4 just doesn't cut it for me. I will be willing to admit what I fear, Judd isn't the guy. I still want to see that third year though.
Him: If DeBoer loses 3 or 4 games again and can't push Alabama into at least the semi finals next year he's got to go. My coworker at that point will be willing to admit what he fears, that KDB just isn't the guy. He still wants to see that third year though.
Half of his friends want DeBoer gone now. They see the talent levels and toughness of the program sliding and want him fired yesterday. They saw a semi final of 4 Saban disciples coaching at 4 universities that aren't Bama and are wondering why they have this outsider ruining their beloved program.
Half of my friends see some poor offensive coaching decisions, road woes, a litany of excuses and worrisome player retention and want Fish canned two months ago.
Both him and I want to see what year 3 looks like. Both of us are more worried than confident that things won't turn out the way we want.
 
The difference is if Fisch had FINISHED this year and made the playoffs at 10-2 which was there for the taking he'd get extended even if he lost in round 1

And I would be good with that

Of course conventional wisdom is he's gone if he ever does that which is another layer of shit on his time here
 
Would’ve been in the Miami Notre Dame discussion. Bet we’d have lose that tie. So get to 11-1.
 
10 years ago success in college football was largely dictated on some combination of 1) geography, 2) history, and 3) ability to look the other way and spend money under the table

Today, the free flowing of funds has largely reduced the impact of geography and stabilized "approved" spending ... so now success is completely aligned based on 1) the size of your LEGAL variable spend through NIL, 2) how much you're willing to laugh at whatever regulatory agency is in charge of "illegal spend" and 3) the ability to secure a billionaire level investor(s) that is willing to fund a program as some kind of passion project, etc. and isn't necessarily concerned about there being a monetary ROI in their investment

In the end you're still going to get roughly the same number of teams in any given year that can win a Natty but the distribution of who gets to sit at that table can and will change versus what it was 10 years ago.
I'd throw coaching in the old way of success. It's obviously still there but I think has way less sway either way.
 
When talking of Kalen DeBoer my Alabama guy at work sounds kinda like me talking about Judd for year 3.
Me: If Fish goes 8-4 again he's got to go. I need 10-2 and playoffs, full stop. A three year build to 8-4 just doesn't cut it for me. I will be willing to admit what I fear, Judd isn't the guy. I still want to see that third year though.
Him: If DeBoer loses 3 or 4 games again and can't push Alabama into at least the semi finals next year he's got to go. My coworker at that point will be willing to admit what he fears, that KDB just isn't the guy. He still wants to see that third year though.
Half of his friends want DeBoer gone now. They see the talent levels and toughness of the program sliding and want him fired yesterday. They saw a semi final of 4 Saban disciples coaching at 4 universities that aren't Bama and are wondering why they have this outsider ruining their beloved program.
Half of my friends see some poor offensive coaching decisions, road woes, a litany of excuses and worrisome player retention and want Fish canned two months ago.
Both him and I want to see what year 3 looks like. Both of us are more worried than confident that things won't turn out the way we want.
Beat me to it. It just clicked that DeBoer actually looks a lot like Fisch going into 2026/year 3. He somehow looks like he has a worse roster and is going together a mediocre season.
 
For UW (or anybody in this era) to be good going forward you need the following:

1. You need upper campus to be invested in the marketing/branding that athletics can have for the University as a whole and have alignment on how upper campus can leverage athletics

2. You need an Athletic Director that is business centric that treats football as part of a Billion dollar business that is hyper competitive about locking in funding, on-field performance, and telling the story needed to link branding, awareness, etc. of the program as well as its role as part of the University ecosystem as a whole

3. You must have a head coach and football operations staff that not only can identify talent but also connect with the players to ensure strong recruitment of those players with their fit into the program (and individual futures) as well as ensuring proper retention of player talent on the roster (keep those that are part of the solution and cutting ties with those that aren't)

4. You need to secure the funding from large whale investor(s) that are aligned to the overall vision with all parties presenting a compelling business case for the investor to sign off on and view themselves not only as a business partner but key stakeholder in the program's overall success.

It's not hard to see why this is all a HUGE issue for the University of Washington:

1. UW isn't a University that is necessarily worried about athletic success impacting their overall branding and profile. It's a Top public university and that's going to remain true whether football shits on itself or is wildly successful. It's not a place that is trying to expand its overall student population so it doesn't necessarily need the lift in applications that often comes with athletic success ... at best the jump in applications during high water points of athletic success may nominally increase the underlying average applicant ... at worst it's just noise in applications that equates to additional time, energy, and likely cost to sift through those applications by undergraduate admissions. And lastly, because of the University's profile academically there's little to no worry about a decline in the quality of the accepted applicant pool due to athletics. So you're stuck in a really awkward spot where unless athletics is a focal point of a University President or whatnot, athletics is not going to be viewed as a priority for upper campus as long as its operating at an acceptable level ... notably as long as athletics isn't an embarrassing representation of the University.

2. Chun is here because he had to find a lifeboat to rescue him from Wazzu. You don't have to look hard to find instances where people have interacted with Chun and not walked away as impressed. In no way does he look like he's bought into the University of Washington nor does he come off as a hyper competitive person who has a desire to win in everything they do. Instead, he looks like the same type of bureaucratic administrator that has paraded around college athletics for too long and is frankly outdated. There's probably still a role for him in college athletic administration but it's not at a place like UW where the competition level with its peers is completely in a kill or be killed environment.

3. Fisch is a mixed bag here ... his talent evaluations and roster management have been bright spots to his tenure whereas his on-field coaching has some flags and the fact that he's struggled to satisfactory commit to the program has lasting impacts throughout his roster and with fans/donors. It's no secret that there isn't strong alignment between his boss (Chun) and that leads to some significant issues. The last 2 weeks has provided some insight into him perhaps not having the pulse on his team/players like maybe he thought he did.

4. This is really the most important aspect and the issues you have with Chun and Fisch making it next to impossible to go to well funded "investors" with a buttoned up business case for investment that a donor is going to sign off on ... never forget that donors aren't uber wealthy by accident. Then you add one of the biggest issues that people in this region have (compared to other areas of the country) in that in the older donor population you have a sensibility and modesty to them that doesn't just blindly throw around "fuck you money" around as a passion project ... instead they invest with purpose and need to feel good about the return on their investment. How you define that return can be different for each donor but it's becoming increasingly difficult to produce that in the current environment.

So it's overall messy and hard to see where this gets better before it probably gets a bit worse without some systemic change (which goes to why the UW President attached his name to what he did this week) ...

It's one of the big reasons why I've been so adamant about things being precarious for UW (notably if Jedd was to leave) because the infrastructure under the hood right now is so unaligned that whenever the band-aid gets ripped off it could get really ugly.

If we're prioritizing ... Chun needs to be ousted before Jedd leaves
All that to essentially say UW doesn't have a culture that gives a shit about football. Why some posters here, who apparently like sports and football don't understand why that is is head scratching. Chalk it up to world views and tribes.
 
I knew Jedd had player retention issues when he couldn't bring his guys over from fucking ARIZONA when that program was DOA.

Anyone surprised by these issues 3 years later is retarded.

Roster talent and offensive playcalling are supposed to be his strengths as a coach.

Instead we have a DC propping up the team's record at this point.

Fire Chun first by all means so the next guy can plan Jedd's replacement.
 
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