the talent gap

chrisvashon

chrisvashon

New Fish
So despite my best efforts, I found myself starting to get sucked in, as always, by the preseason hope. Husky stadium, year two of the Wilcox era, there are things to be excited about. Then I wandered over to esuck (lol).

Christ, what a depressing reality check. One thread comparing the rosters of UO and UW had the consensus being (once you took out tards who think Colt is better than ASJ) that they'd take 4 or 5 of our players. 22 starters and they think maybe 5 of ours are better than theirs. My solace is that they are underestimating our linebackers but, even so, ouch.

Another thread broke down our star players' stat lines against UO. Take a look:

Keith Price
2012- 19-31 145 yards 0 Td's 2 Int's
2011- 24-35 143 yards 2 Td's 2 Int's
2010- 14-28 127 yards 1 Td 0 Int

Kasen Williams
2012- 6-48 0 Td
2011- 6-79 1 Td

ASJ
2012- 2-33 0 Td
2011- 1-(minus)6 0 Td

That is unreal. Our stars just straight up disappear. Anyways, crown 'em. Our "rivals" make it 10 in a row this year.*

*Although I watched a replay of the USC-UO game yesterday and was reminded that a mediocre USC offense torched the Ducks for 51 points. So hope springs eternal and all that.
 
Sark's offense always sucks against good to decent defenses that is something that everyone seems to forget.

Also I like how that Quook conveniently left out how Polk did against them and Sankey.
 
So despite my best efforts, I found myself starting to get sucked in, as always, by the preseason hope. Husky stadium, year two of the Wilcox era, there are things to be excited about. Then I wandered over to esuck (lol).

Christ, what a depressing reality check. One thread comparing the rosters of UO and UW had the consensus being (once you took out tards who think Colt is better than ASJ) that they'd take 4 or 5 of our players. 22 starters and they think maybe 5 of ours are better than theirs. My solace is that they are underestimating our linebackers but, even so, ouch.

Another thread broke down our star players' stat lines against UO. Take a look:

Keith Price
2012- 19-31 145 yards 0 Td's 2 Int's
2011- 24-35 143 yards 2 Td's 2 Int's
2010- 14-28 127 yards 1 Td 0 Int

Kasen Williams
2012- 6-48 0 Td
2011- 6-79 1 Td

ASJ
2012- 2-33 0 Td
2011- 1-(minus)6 0 Td

That is unreal. Our stars just straight up disappear. Anyways, crown 'em. Our "rivals" make it 10 in a row this year.*

*Although I watched a replay of the USC-UO game yesterday and was reminded that a mediocre USC offense torched the Ducks for 51 points. So hope springs eternal and all that.
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#HiMatmik!

 
Sark's offense always sucks against good to decent defenses that is something that everyone seems to forget.

Also I like how that Quook conveniently left out how Polk did against them and Sankey.
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Sankey is a gamer, no doubt. But he can't do it himself.

2012 Rushing: B. Sankey (WASH) - 25 CAR, 104 YDS, 2 TD
2011 C. Polk 24 80 3.3

 
Sark's offense always sucks against good to decent defenses that is something that everyone seems to forget.

Also I like how that Quook conveniently left out how Polk did against them and Sankey.
Click to expand...

Sankey is a gamer, no doubt. But he can't do it himself.

2012 Rushing: B. Sankey (WASH) - 25 CAR, 104 YDS, 2 TD
2011 C. Polk 24 80 3.3
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Polk was slowed down in 2011 but he still had 6 receptions for 31 yards so over 100 yards total offense.

In 2010: He had 17 carries for 73 yards(4.3 YPC)

In 2009: 18 carries for 104 yards(5.8 YPC) with a TD.

In 2008: He was shut down only had 19 yards on 14 carries(1.4 YPC).
 
Lyerla and ASJ are both really good, but I don't think Lyerla is far behind ASJ, if at all. Lyerla is faster, tougher, and far better with the ball in his hands than ASJ. I don't know who is the better blocker, but I do know ASJ isn't all that good at it. Oregon even lined Lyerla up at RB at times. I won't be surprised if Lyerla has a better NFL career.
 
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So despite my best efforts, I found myself starting to get sucked in, as always, by the preseason hope. Husky stadium, year two of the Wilcox era, there are things to be excited about. Then I wandered over to esuck (lol).

Christ, what a depressing reality check. One thread comparing the rosters of UO and UW had the consensus being (once you took out tards who think Colt is better than ASJ) that they'd take 4 or 5 of our players. 22 starters and they think maybe 5 of ours are better than theirs. My solace is that they are underestimating our linebackers but, even so, ouch.

Another thread broke down our star players' stat lines against UO. Take a look:

Keith Price
2012- 19-31 145 yards 0 Td's 2 Int's
2011- 24-35 143 yards 2 Td's 2 Int's
2010- 14-28 127 yards 1 Td 0 Int

Kasen Williams
2012- 6-48 0 Td
2011- 6-79 1 Td

ASJ
2012- 2-33 0 Td
2011- 1-(minus)6 0 Td

That is unreal. Our stars just straight up disappear. Anyways, crown 'em. Our "rivals" make it 10 in a row this year.*

*Although I watched a replay of the USC-UO game yesterday and was reminded that a mediocre USC offense torched the Ducks for 51 points. So hope springs eternal and all that.
Click to expand...

Stay off educk, its turning you into a fucktardo. Dude, you've got to have better things to do.! Holy shitballs! Watch UW vs BSU and then make assertions and roster comparisons.

If we can just find a coach by the time we play Oregon, Our rosters will stack up just fine. In other words, if Sark coaches like he did his 1st year, UO is in deep doo-doo!
 
So despite my best efforts, I found myself starting to get sucked in, as always, by the preseason hope. Husky stadium, year two of the Wilcox era, there are things to be excited about. Then I wandered over to esuck (lol).

Christ, what a depressing reality check. One thread comparing the rosters of UO and UW had the consensus being (once you took out tards who think Colt is better than ASJ) that they'd take 4 or 5 of our players. 22 starters and they think maybe 5 of ours are better than theirs. My solace is that they are underestimating our linebackers but, even so, ouch.

Another thread broke down our star players' stat lines against UO. Take a look:

Keith Price
2012- 19-31 145 yards 0 Td's 2 Int's
2011- 24-35 143 yards 2 Td's 2 Int's
2010- 14-28 127 yards 1 Td 0 Int

Kasen Williams
2012- 6-48 0 Td
2011- 6-79 1 Td

ASJ
2012- 2-33 0 Td
2011- 1-(minus)6 0 Td

That is unreal. Our stars just straight up disappear. Anyways, crown 'em. Our "rivals" make it 10 in a row this year.*

*Although I watched a replay of the USC-UO game yesterday and was reminded that a mediocre USC offense torched the Ducks for 51 points. So hope springs eternal and all that.
Click to expand...

Stay off educk, its turning you into a fucktardo. Dude, you've got to have better things to do.! Holy shitballs! Watch UW vs BSU and then make assertions and roster comparisons.

If we can just find a coach by the time we play Oregon, Our rosters will stack up just fine. In other words, if Sark coaches like he did his 1st year, UO is in deep doo-doo!
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2:30 bong rips >>>>> 2:30 shots of five hour energy
 
Lyerla and ASJ are both really good, but I don't think Lyerla is far behind ASJ, if at all. Lyerla is faster, tougher, and far better with the ball in his hands than ASJ. I don't know who is the better blocker, but I do know ASJ isn't all that good at it. Oregon even lined Lyerla up at RB at times. I won't be surprised if Lyerla has a better NFL career.
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Don't know about that

Lyerla - 25 392 6
ASJ - 69 852 7

Lyerla is a check down. ASJ is our entire receiving core. #69

 
Lyerla and ASJ are both really good, but I don't think Lyerla is far behind ASJ, if at all. Lyerla is faster, tougher, and far better with the ball in his hands than ASJ. I don't know who is the better blocker, but I do know ASJ isn't all that good at it. Oregon even lined Lyerla up at RB at times. I won't be surprised if Lyerla has a better NFL career.
Click to expand...

Don't know about that

Lyerla - 25 392 6
ASJ - 69 852 7

Lyerla is a check down. ASJ is our entire receiving core. #69
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Totally different offenses. Lyerla plays in a run first offense and has to share the ball with a lot of other guys. ASJ plays in a pass first offense where he and Kasen were the only options. You don't think Lyerla would have better stats in UW's offense?

25 receptions for 392 is an average of 15.7 yards per catch. That's not a check down. That's the highest average for any player on Oregon who caught at least 10 balls. Oregon had 7 guys who caught more than 20 passes (and another with 19), UW had 4.

 
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Perhaps "afterthought" would be a better descriptor than "check down."

Our passing attack is built around ASJ because he's the best tight end in the country. Even Sark knows to get the best players the ball (unless it's the running back).

Chip is a good coach. And Lyerla had 25 catches all season. On the most prolific offense in the country. I'm guessing they ran more plays than anyone else. 25 grabs is really pedestrian in that context.
 
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Lyerla and ASJ are both really good, but I don't think Lyerla is far behind ASJ, if at all. Lyerla is faster, tougher, and far better with the ball in his hands than ASJ. I don't know who is the better blocker, but I do know ASJ isn't all that good at it. Oregon even lined Lyerla up at RB at times. I won't be surprised if Lyerla has a better NFL career.
Click to expand...

Don't know about that

Lyerla - 25 392 6
ASJ - 69 852 7

Lyerla is a check down. ASJ is our entire receiving core. #69
Click to expand...

Totally different offenses. Lyerla plays in a run first offense and has to share the ball with a lot of other guys. ASJ plays in a pass first offense where he and Kasen were the only options. You don't think Lyerla would have better stats in UW's offense?

25 receptions for 392 is an average of 15.7 yards per catch. That's not a check down. That's the highest average for any player on Oregon who caught at least 10 balls. Oregon had 7 guys who caught more than 20 passes (and another with 19), UW had 4.
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Are you talking about the pass first offense that ran the ball more than they passed? Or is it the Pass first offense that allowed Sankey to be #3 in Rushing attempts in the Pac-12?

Just trying to clarify.
 
Run to pass ratio for each team in the Pac-12 according to the 2012 NCAA stats:

Oregon - 685/373 = 1.836 rushes per pass attempt
Arizona St. - 598/413 = 1.448
Stanford - 549/399 = 1.376
California - 451/366 = 1.232
UCLA - 599/496 = 1.208
Utah - 446/351 = 1.271
Washington - 466/438 = 1.064
Colorado - 425/404 = 1.052
Arizona - 544/538 = 1.011
Oregon St. - 442/504 = .877
Southern California - 392/461 = .850
Washington St. - 252/624 = .403

Since Washington ran more than they passed, I wouldn't call Sark's offense pass first. I would say that Washington's offense was balanced and below average in rushing and passing last year, probably because the touches were so heavily concentrated on Williams, ASJ, and Sankey and because the Husky OC sucks.

The primary difference between the production of ASJ and Lyerla isn't the playcalling or even the type of offense...it's the distribution of touches to different players on the respective offenses. Oregon had 7 guys catch 20 or more passes last year, and the max was 45. Washington only had four guys catch 20 or more passes and the bulk of those went to Williams (77) and ASJ (69). As you also mentioned, Sankey had more carries than the rest of the Husky roster combined.

Washington has to spread carries and receptions around for the up tempo offense to work effectively in 2013.
 
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Perhaps "afterthought" would be a better descriptor than "check down."

Our passing attack is built around ASJ because he's the best tight end in the country. Even Sark knows to get the best players the ball (unless it's the running back).

Chip is a good coach. And Lyerla had 25 catches all season. On the most prolific offense in the country. I'm guessing they ran more plays than anyone else. 25 grabs is really pedestrian in that context.
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It was the third highest on their team. I'm also looking past the stats. Boobs had a nice post showing why Lyerla didn't put up huge numbers. No receiver on Oregon did. I'm glad we have ASJ, but Lyerla does many things as good or better than ASJ.

 
Looking past the stats means recognizing that ASJ put up those numbers despite an atrocious offense around him and every D keying on him.

No one playing Oregon was thinking "how do we stop Colt?!"

ASJ > Colt, and it's not that close.

 
Looking past the stats means recognizing that ASJ put up those numbers despite an atrocious offense around him and every D keying on him.

No one playing Oregon was thinking "how do we stop Colt?!"

ASJ > Colt, and it's not that close.
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Nobody playing Oregon is thinking that much about stopping Lyerla because they have so many other guys to worry about first. Not so with the Huskies. ASJ is a terrific talent but from an NFL standpoint it looks to me like Lyerla isn't far behind, if he's behind at all. That kid is Aaron Hernandez without the tats and the nasty habit of killing people. They'll both spend their 20's playing football on Sundays.
 
Looking past the stats means recognizing that ASJ put up those numbers despite an atrocious offense around him and every D keying on him.

No one playing Oregon was thinking "how do we stop Colt?!"

ASJ > Colt, and it's not that close.
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Defenses couldn't key on ASJ because of Williams.

No one worried about Colt because they were focused on Mariota, Barner, and DAT.

The comparison is really apples and oranges, at best. Different players around them, different skill sets, different offenses, etc.

It's very rare in recent years that any Duck puts up the receiving numbers ASJ did last year. I think ASJ is better than Colt too as a receiving tight end. As an H-back type, I'd probably take Colt first. He can do a lot of different things, including catching a Hail Mary when necessary.
 
Nobody playing Oregon is thinking that much about stopping Lyerla because they have so many other guys to worry about first. Not so with the Huskies.
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That was exactly my point. ASJ is putting up these gaudy numbers against double teams. Everyone knows the ball is going to him - and most of the time there is nothing they can do about it. That incredible hail mary catch against Cal in the endzone pretty much sums it up.

Lyerla is catching 25 passes against secondaries that are gassed covering DAT and Huff and Mariota. He had as many catches as Barner, Lowe (who?), Addison (who?), and Hawkins (who?). He is a complement to their stars.

And the Hernandez comparison, um... here is his Mackey Award winning stat line:
68 850 5

Look familiar?

Whatever. You love Lyerla, good for you. Irregardless, it's mute.
 
Nobody playing Oregon is thinking that much about stopping Lyerla because they have so many other guys to worry about first. Not so with the Huskies.
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That was exactly my point. ASJ is putting up these gaudy numbers against double teams. Everyone knows the ball is going to him - and most of the time there is nothing they can do about it. That incredible hail mary catch against Cal in the endzone pretty much sums it up.

Lyerla is catching 25 passes against secondaries that are gassed covering DAT and Huff and Mariota. He had as many catches as Barner, Lowe (who?), Addison (who?), and Hawkins (who?). He is a complement to their stars.

And the Hernandez comparison, um... here is his Mackey Award winning stat line:
68 850 5

Look familiar?

Whatever. You love Lyerla, good for you. Irregardless, it's mute.
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They are ranked #2 (ASJ) and #3 (Lyerla) for TE's on this NFL draft prospect rating. They are both really good. Let's see how Lyerla does this year, but the Aaron Hernandez isn't a bad comparison at all. They are versatile players who can line up at TE, H-Back, and FB. You cherry picked Hernandez's junior year to try and prove a point, but what about their sophomore seasons? In Hernandez sophomore year he went for 34, 381, 11.2, 5 TD's. Lyerla went for 25, 392, 15.7, 7 TD's.

Do you really think ASJ would catch anywhere near 69 passes for Oregon? There's only so many balls to catch, and over half of Oregon's passes are bubble screens to the WR's that Marriotta calls at the line based on how the defense lines up. That's why you see no name WR's that caught as many balls as Lyerla. It's not because he isn't really good. He's a beast.

 
You could plug our skills guys into the the Oregon offense and they would not miss a beat.

The talent gap with Oregon is in the trenches on both sides of the ball.

Steve Greatwood & Jerry Azzinaro (Philly) have not got enough credit for Oregon's recent success.
 
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